----BEGIN CLASS---- [13:00] #startclass [13:00] Hi everyone [13:01] hi schubisu [13:01] Hello Schubisu [13:01] My name is Robin Schubert, I'm a physicist and got to learn about this channel in 2017 [13:02] to begin and end sessions, we usually do a roll call; everyone who is here for the session will write his/her name (or nick if you're more comfortable with that) [13:02] ritik [13:02] kiyo [13:02] this way we will have a clean beginning and end of the sessions, and make sure we have all your attention. [13:02] anjali [13:02] Sahil Dhiman [13:02] I'll announce the roll call ;) [13:02] hold your horses people! [13:02] Roll Call [13:02] now [13:02] Jason Braganza [13:02] Robin Schubert [13:02] ritik [13:02] Mohit [13:02] anjali [13:02] Mehul [13:02] kiyo [13:02] Sahil Dhiman [13:03] Saptak S [13:03] kamalesh [13:04] nice [13:04] From the last session, kushal gave some homework and shared links to read [13:04] we want to talk about basics of communication today [13:05] as kushal said; programming is just a small fraction to what it needs when working in the F/OSS community [13:05] communication is a key skill [13:05] and communication can be hard [13:05] Hello Everyone! [13:06] even when seeing the other one, speaking face to face, communication can go terribly wrong. In written communication, some rules have to be followed to avoid misunderstandings and frustration [13:06] I assume that you have read the provided links. Let's take any question you have on material first [13:08] no questions? or too shy? [13:09] I read only one link from 2018 log, in which i did not get any doubt [13:09] ritik: that was the one linke not shared by kushal [13:09] s/linke/link [13:10] This would be my first session. [13:10] raghavgururajan: welcome then. [13:10] the two links i shared people. [13:10] have you read them? [13:11] Everyone please make sure to appear at least 5 minutes early in the channel when there's a session [13:11] schubisu: I think I took the wrong link then. I will see yesterday's logs after today's session. [13:11] yes, some good introductions to FOSS history and fundamental principals on both [13:12] anyone here who can tell me the principals of email netiquette? [13:12] communication and behaviours [13:13] schubisu: Thanks! I might be joining at irregular times, depending on client call at my work. My apologies. And thanks for this training opportunity. [13:13] On e-mails make sure to write in clear eEglish, not be rude and be aware that contributors may not always be online. Contributors also will need clear instructions on your problem. [13:13] No HTML? [13:14] kiyo: that applies for any written communication, I guess [13:14] and bottom-posting in replies. [13:14] raghavgururajan: can you explain what is bottom posting? [13:15] schubisu: Sure! When replying to an e-mail, our response will be below the quoted block. [13:15] raghavgururajan: and is that desired or to be avoided? [13:16] Desired. [13:16] raghavgururajan: :) I will share the links to the material again, you also should go through them [13:16] let's start over again [13:17] please let me know who read the material. answer "yes" if you did, "no" if you didn't [13:17] yes [13:17] Sure thing! [13:18] ritik, anjali, emsar046 are you still with us? [13:18] Yes. [13:18] no, [13:18] yeas [13:19] yes* [13:19] yes [13:19] i mean yes im here but no i didnt get a chance to go through the logs [13:19] schubisu: i am here too, sorry for being late. [13:20] shivamsoni: okay [13:21] so I count 3 who haven't read the material [13:21] who of the other can tell what top posting is, and why we avoid it, and how we should reply to mailing lists? [13:21] type ! if you have a suggestion [13:22] The replies to the mail should be "inline" and not "top-post." [13:22] ! [13:22] anjali: correct, but no answer to any of my questions ;) [13:22] next [13:23] With top posting, information not related to the reply is also sent across and it also breaks the flow of communication [13:23] ! [13:23] next [13:24] Reply after the questions/comments is more natural to readers. [13:24] I think some messages are missing in the last session's logs. [13:24] I see no messages with nick batul [13:24] raghavgururajan: if you're reffering to messages from batul, yes [13:25] Okay. [13:25] batul is a bot that helps us with communication here in the channel [13:25] as you can see, this is a form of communication that requires your full attention ;) [13:26] Got it! [13:26] we have to read (!) and understand the thoughts of others, in a language that is not the mothertongue for most of us [13:26] there are lots of forms of communication and different tools as well [13:27] it's important to learn when and how to use which of them [13:28] as philomath correctly said, replying to a mailing list with all the history attached at the bottom and the reply on top (which is referred to as top-posting) is bad for the flow of a discussion [13:28] it's unnecessary and rude; you have to consider that all receipients get a whole bunch of text they already have [13:28] raghavgururajan, all comments for after class. please let schubisu focus & finish and reply only when questions are asked. or feedback solicited. [13:29] so it's good practice to reduce the history to that quoted snipped that you refer to in your reply and trim the rest [13:30] raghavgururajan: XMPP and IRC both have their strenghs and you will need both, depending on the task [13:31] jasonbraganza: Sure thing, sorry. [13:31] I suggest that everyone (re-)reads this document now http://www.shakthimaan.com/downloads/glv/presentations/mailing-list-etiquette.pdf and we continue here in 10 minutes [13:35] ! [13:36] next [13:37] no question kiyo? [13:37] jasonbraganza, maybe slow typing. [13:38] 1. Is there a mail service that uses bottom posing by default that we can explore? most service I use have defaulted to top posting. [13:38] aah. i shall wait. take your time kiyu [13:38] kiyo: bottom posting is not better that top posting ;) [13:38] kiyo: what you should do is to trim the history to the relevant parts [13:39] kiyo: that requires thoughtful editing of you email and there's no client (that I'm aware of) that can do this for you [13:39] s/you/your/ [13:39] kiyo, best get used to doing it manually. because like schubisu says. the thing is not to put things at the bottom. rather we need to quote the relevant parts of their message and respond to them. [13:39] so i guess concentrate on interleaving questions and awnsers [13:39] yes exactly [13:41] 1 minute to go [13:41] ! [13:41] next [13:41] What's RTF? [13:41] raghavgururajan: short for Rich Text Format [13:42] I see. Thanks! [13:42] raghavgururajan: that's the XML which is composed by those WYSIWYG (what you see is what you get) text editors [13:42] ! [13:43] okay, everyone should be done reading by now. Any further questions? [13:43] next [13:43] Regarding attachments, how about PGP signatures? [13:43] ! [13:44] raghavgururajan, please expand and clarify? [13:44] ! [13:44] If the e-mail sent is digitally signed using OpenPGP, the digital signature of the e-mail is sent as attachment. [13:45] raghavgururajan: PGP signatures as attachment to mailing list emails are fine. They do not compare to pictures or other media in terms of size [13:45] Okay. [13:45] next [13:45] raghavgururajan mentioned XMPP earlier, what's that ? [13:45] emsar046: please look that up in your favourite search engine. It's another widely used decentralized chat protocol [13:46] next [13:46] sure, schubisu [13:47] ">" signifies that we are quoting someone right?, can we use any other symbol for quoting? [13:47] shivamsoni, > is the accepted convention. best stick to it. [13:48] shivamsoni: emails are built in a certain order and with various symbols that are interpreted the same way by almost any email client [13:48] shivamsoni: so no, other clients will probably not understand if you use a different symbol, hence the answer will be formatted strangely on other clients [13:49] shivamsoni: there are more parts of an email that are hidden by most clients but present in any email we send or receive. It's all plain text in the end. [13:50] so if there are no further question, we can wrap this up [13:50] as mentioned earlier, the communication channel we've chosed for this training is IRC [13:50] okay, thanks. [13:51] we also have some conventions here, and like with email, there are some symbols and commands interpreted in special ways [13:51] ! [13:51] next [13:51] The IRC server is exposing my current mobile IP address, is there a way to mask it? [13:52] Arikazufu: yes, I assume there are many ways [13:52] Arikazufu: you can e.g. torify your connection or use another proxy [13:52] Arikazufu: however, I'm sure you will find more solutions if you search for that online [13:53] to make this IRC communication work, it's essential for you to read carefully [13:53] ask, if you didn't understand something [13:53] do not interfere and disturb sessions; you might get silenced or kicked [13:54] Thank you schubisu. I will use the current web client over TOR for now and find out more. [13:54] if kicked, that does not mean you're not allowed to participate anymore, just return and behave ;) [13:54] Arikazufu: okay [13:54] there was another link to a very important resource shared by kushal on Monday [13:55] http://www.catb.org/esr/faqs/smart-questions.html [13:55] please make sure to read this! [13:55] in the F/OSS community, you will communicate with busy developers, spending their free time on making great tools [13:56] Help is usually highly appreaciated [13:56] Sorry schubisu, for going off topic. It just took me by surprise when I saw my mobile IP. [13:56] Questions are usually welcome [13:56] Arikazufu: please read and do not disturb for now [13:57] however, if you do not know how to communicate is a proper way, the result will be that you'll either be ignored or receive angry responses [13:57] because you waste that developer's time [13:57] learn how to ask your questions in a smart way [13:58] please read that article after class [13:58] also for the next session, please watch this documentary https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Q6Fzbgs_Lg [13:59] any questions before we end today's session? [13:59] ! [14:00] next [14:00] If we need to encrypt files and send them using pki for whatever reason is there good conventions or tools for doing this? [14:01] kiyo: please stay online, maybe we can discuss that after the session [14:01] everyone, please make sure to really watch the documentary, so we can talk about it on Friday, Jul 29th 18:30IST [14:02] Roll Call [14:02] Robin Schubert [14:02] ritik [14:02] Mehul [14:02] Anjali [14:02] Ari [14:02] kiyo [14:02] mars ----END CLASS----